The evolution of Adam - The biological purpose of death. by gavvet

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· @gavvet ·
$293.03
The evolution of Adam - The biological purpose of death.
Last week I asked the question of if there was death before Adam.
-

I got many great and varied responses.

https://www.lds.org/bc/content/shared/content/images/gospel-library/manual/32501/32501_all_007_01-AnimalCreation.jpg
[Img Source](https://www.lds.org/bc/content/shared/content/images/gospel-library/manual/32501/32501_all_007_01-AnimalCreation.jpg)

Some where dismissive of the whole Eden story, seeing it simply as a fairy-tale or fiction. 

Others saw much of metaphor in the Eden account while for others it was a real head scratcher.

Still others hold dogmatically to the idea that Adam was the first to introduce death into the world and that anything (meaning the eaten fruit) that transpired before that was magically or miraculously taken care of.

So here are a couple of my thoughts, but before that a little look at what the biological purpose of death is.
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If a population is able to reproduce then their numbers increase. If numbers continue to increase unabated then soon a population will run out of the resources required to sustain life. Death is the necessary mechanism to maintain a balance of resources.

Death is an absolute biological necessity.
-

Lets take for instance the simple example of how many rats you get from one pair in one year. If you start with a pair, then each female reproduces 10 babies every 2 months

Let's assume 50% of the babies are female.
-
- After 2 months- 6 males, 6 females. 
- After 4 months- 36 males, 36 females. 
- After 6 months- 216 males, 216 females. 
- After 8 months- 1296 males, 1296 females. 
- After 10 months- 7776 males, 7776 females. 
- After 12 months- 46656 males, 46656 females. 

93 312 rats, assuming that none of them die.
-

By three years that's close to half a billion rats... just from one pair.
-

Now just imagine the numbers when we start to consider some fish or amphibians that produce millions of eggs per spawning.

Some insects are so prolific and their reproductive cycles are so much shorter, that if some of them were to reproduce unchecked and none were to die - forget about food for them, they would cover the entire planet in a layer composed entirely of themselves a few meters thick, within a year.

Then, we haven't even begun to think of bacteria, whose reproductive cycles are measured in hours and minutes. They may be microscopic but they still account for the largest amount of biomass on the planet. They are even found kilometers deep under the ground gnawing away at solid rocks. 

If bacteria reproduced unabated the entire planet would be overwhelmed pretty rapidly.
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Simply, from a Darwinian perspective, the purpose of an organism is to be born,  reproduce some offspring that are slight variations of themselves and then exit the scene as quickly as possible. 
-

This is to cut down the amount of competition for resources between parents and the next generation. The faster the cycle can repeat itself, the faster the environment will select for better adaptions and the species will evolve.

The smallest, simplest and most prolific organisms evolve the fastest. That is why, in one bacterial infection, if a person does not complete the course of antibiotic medicines they are given, a drug resistant strain may emerge.

The case of the common cold virus is evolution in action. 

It's in an evolutionary arms race against the human immune system, and every year a new strain or two must emerges that the human immune system hasn't seen before, because if it doesn't adapt it will die out due to the fact that once a person has had that strain of the flu, they become immune to it going forward.

So simply put, if Adam was immortal in the garden of Eden along with the rest of the animals there that could not have been the intended end state.
-

Eden was of limited geographical extent with finite resources. 
-

It was, after all eastward of something else. 

What was going on outside of Eden? and if Adam and eve were able to reproduce before becoming mortal and were in fact to stay immortal and produce immortal offspring even if Eden was the entire planet it would have become pretty crowded pretty quickly.

By now there would not have even been standing room left...
-


Previous parts of this Series.
-
[Were the seven days of creation in Genesis seven twenty four hour periods? - Where do these notions originate?](https://steemit.com/religion/@gavvet/were-the-seven-days-of-creation-in-genesis-seven-twenty-four-hour-periods-where-do-these-notions-originate)

[Were the seven days of creation in Genesis seven twenty four hour periods? - Delving a little deeper](https://steemit.com/religion/@gavvet/were-the-seven-days-of-creation-in-genesis-seven-twenty-four-hour-periods-delving-a-little-deeper)

[Were the seven days of creation in Genesis seven twenty four hour periods? - Into the detail](https://steemit.com/religion/@gavvet/were-the-seven-days-of-creation-in-genesis-seven-twenty-four-hour-periods-into-the-detail)

[Were the seven days of creation in Genesis seven twenty four hour periods? - Some conclusions](https://steemit.com/religion/@gavvet/were-the-seven-days-of-creation-in-genesis-seven-twenty-four-hour-periods-some-conclusions)

[Were the seven days of creation in Genesis seven twenty four hour periods? - Some more conclusions](https://steemit.com/religion/@gavvet/65xomk-were-the-seven-days-of-creation-in-genesis-seven-twenty-four-hour-periods-some-conclusions)

[Were the seven days of creation in Genesis seven twenty four hour periods? - The implications.](https://steemit.com/religion/@gavvet/were-the-seven-days-of-creation-in-genesis-seven-twenty-four-hour-periods-the-implications)

[The evolution of Adam - a conundrum](https://steemit.com/religion/@gavvet/the-evolution-of-adam-a-conundrum)

[The evolution of Adam - Who is Adam](https://steemit.com/religion/@gavvet/the-evolution-of-adam-who-is-adam)

[The evolution of Adam - Two trees and choice](https://steemit.com/religion/@gavvet/the-evolution-of-adam-two-trees-and-choice)

[The evolution of Adam - Partaking of the fruit and feeling naked](https://steemit.com/religion/@gavvet/the-evolution-of-adam-partaking-of-the-fruit-and-feeling-naked)

[The evolution of Adam - Was there death before Adam](https://steemit.com/religion/@gavvet/the-evolution-of-adam-was-there-death-before-adam)
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vote details (765)
@marconah ·
Thanks for sharing, good post.
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@builderofcastles ·
This is, of course, assuming that the earth is a fixed size.
And that resources are fixed and finite.
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@ichiko ·
Sure
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@gavvet ·
$0.37
That's earth I live on, which one do you live on.
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@builderofcastles ·
There are arguments about what shape the earth is.  Why do you feel so sure about your stance?

Look at plate tectonics.  We are to believe that long ago, all of the land was on one side of the globe, and then it broke apart into pieces, and then moved to different areas of the earth?  An alternative theory is that the earth expanded.  It is a much better and more solid theory... except for everyone believes the earth is a big "solid" ball of matter.  Yep, that is what we were all taught in school.

That the earth is a big ball, and the inside is a all molten, and the center is iron, and that is why we have a magnetic north... except that iron doesn't hold magnetism much above room temperature. (relatively speaking)

What would happen if we actually find hollow earth theories to be true?
Anyway, we drilled down a mere eight miles and found water.  We found water in a state we didn't think water could exist.  So, really, we do not know much of anything about our planet.

However, if you delve into the metaphysics of life and reincarnation, then you get to places of logic that state that the being can only be born if their is enough resources... or conversely, that they were born, there is enough resources.

Resource scarcity, especially oil as of late, is something you were propagandized in school about.  It is the way to control the masses.  It is a way to make things that are abundant and free, into scarce and expensive.
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@kouba01 · (edited)
$0.03
My idea that we as living and sentient entities are really just caretakers of our ability to reproduce from nature's point of view is a strange thing to contemplate.  For all of our self-importance, "we" are the disposable bits.
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@palerider ·
Interesting post!!
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@eureka9 ·
$0.73
Hello Friend Nice Post by You
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@adnanalkrtany ·
Greetings to all, please vote and follow up Thank you all
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@stmit ·
Thanks for information. very useful of Reproduction topic. thanks @gavvet
100% like and resteem.
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@moyse ·
Good preaching
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@rebatesteem ·
great post. thank you for sharing
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@a-alice ·
Hahaa from the old days i still think adam and Eva .. turns out eva also other name is Eden: o?
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@chanchuwei ·
nice post
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@vm2904 ·
$1.37
@gavvet -  An interesting question.  I think some sort of destructive force (whether in the form of death or not) would have been essential to counter the force of creation.  Balance has always been the key theme of the universe.  Therefore, the concept of death may have been tagged on after the concept of mortality came along but  recognition of the fact that some destructive force would have existed even before Adam is what I believe.
You have given a great example of the scenario that would get created if death was non-existent.    I remember reading about the rabbits multiplying during my school days.
Thanks for this thought provoking article.  Upvoted full.
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@tiffanyrej ·
Death is necessary I think and that is why the creator allowed it to exist.
👍  
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@arslanbhatti91 ·
yup
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@bhavnapatel68 ·
$0.03
Great post @gavvet. Thank you for sharing. From this I see that we can increase the size in population but we cannot increase the size of the earth. So the major part of the earth is loaded with population and is life cycled.
👍  
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@pksam9 ·
Yes, it is great.
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@chanchuwei ·
nice post
👍  
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@raist ·
Great, it seems you in depth knowledge of evolution. Death is necessary in this world. Thanks for sharing.
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@goldcoin ·
Very interesting post. it is great  .@gavvet
have a nice day.
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@fauzi03 ·
Amazing post.


I resteem now
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@redeyes ·
$1.98
Wow! It is very amazing!
👍  ,
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@maya7 ·
Very true friend,death is a necessary mechanism to balance development. Our country is a good example of imbalance of birth and death rates. Due to over population our country have run out of the resources for its distention. Due to the development of medical science death rate dropped but birth rates remains unchanged due to ignorance of the people.so,very true it is a very necessary mechanism. Thanks for sharing, wish you good luck good health and happiness friend happy steeming.
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@sizuka ·
wow
![pwdb_themenkomplexe216-_v-gseagaleriexl (1).jpg](https://steemitimages.com/DQmXhbEiTPtvVq21WX4Pzz7HwgzUq5DBaeDaSPFwmw6uEj9/pwdb_themenkomplexe216-_v-gseagaleriexl%20(1).jpg)
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@ahlawat ·
Nice to see these beautiful pics. Thanks for sharing.
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@serkagan ·
$1.37
I agree with you @gavvet, if all were immortal, then such planets as the Earth would need thousands, or even more :)
👍  , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , ,
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@tiffanyrej ·
If man will be immortal, then we won't have time to post on steemit because probably, what we'll be doing is just eat and sleep all day ^_^
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@mdominicorobin ·
Life has to remain mysterious. So newborns will ask more questions.
👍  
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@arslanbhatti91 ·
agree
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@himansh.urayal ·
Every word is correct
👍  
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@villainy ·
To my understanding, Adam and Eve were the first people of their kind.

But there were other humans on the planet before them.
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@sophistryproof ·
Hi @villainy that is my understanding also.  How did you come about this understanding?  Thanks.
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@informatikerhb ·
Your thoughts are right and your post is great.
But I miss some way the ethical and philosophical aspect.
👍  
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@sweeneydean ·
Really cool post bro. I think a lot of people forgot that back then people lived much longer I'm not sure 🤔 on the number Adam died think maybe 900 I think hi was still a very strong man because earth was still frash and can you  imagine the  retaliation to  Kane killing able the battles of those days so yeah there must have been many deaths before Adam really cool post man upvoted and resteemed 🤙🏻🤙🏻🤙🏻
👍  
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@steemclaira ·
great post..you make us to question ourselves about the evolution of the earth and its living species..but im sad to say that im not  a catholic person and we don't believe the story of adam or eve..what we believe is the natural origin and we believe in the re carnation..but it's nice to know other beliefs about the origin of the life..thanks for sharing this with us..very informative and very logical.  :)
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@sophistryproof ·
Hi @steemclaira, You said you are not a catholic person, what is your belief system called, if you don't mind me asking?
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@cauchudeptrai ·
i love you <3
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@albuluhi · (edited)
you are so right @gavvet, I agree with you that death is something that is needed in this life, all reason can think, how  the state of the world if ever since adam until now there is no death. but in my opinion the first die in the world is the son of adam, habil, during the dispute with his brother qabil. the natural resources of the earth according to its time, which will eventually be exhausted all, the earth will find its death.
thank you @gavvet.
👍  ,
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@gasaudio ·
What if Adam & Eve had not transgressed? They would still be alive today!
👍  
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@avagado ·
Amazing post. thanks for sharing. 
@gavvet
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@juansurf67 ·
good work , follow you , and restemmit
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@amayag ·
interesting post!!!
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@voteman ·
Thanks for @gavvet. interesting and useful article.

For your post propagation.
Upvote/Resteem
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@daniel.tan ·
@gavvet from what I come to understand, the fall of Man changes everything and that includes the original plan of God. But God is sovereign and He knows what is to come and as the creator of all things, the over-population may not be a challenge if he's truly God. 

Just my 2cents..
👍  
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@sandalphon ·
upvoted. raised interesting points.
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@helex ·
We can't imagine the picture of the world if no one die. situation are very dangerous and Cycle of earth are not maintaine. So picture are very bad if no one die.
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@abudar ·
@gavvet I am very happy to read your post
this is the basis of human origin
at least I understand about the history of adam
and acknowledge what happened to Adam and Eve at that time.
👍  
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@aclenx ·
Is the story of adam and eve is simillar to the women and the man on the bamboo? In filipino si "Ang babae at lalaki sa nabiyak na kawayan?" I'm just curious.
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@practicaleric · (edited)
Brilliant post. You have clearly outlined the importance of death and how there needs to be a balance  between birth and death  so as not to strain resources.I guess in the days of Adam prior to eating the forbidden fruit, they (animals included) probably couldn't procreate. However, after eating the fruit procreation and death came about.
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@f3nix ·
of course it's like that. Death came with the original sin. If we want to talk in that perspective. I don't know why theology is so poorly tackled always.
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@kainmarx ·
$1.40
When does one consider this great universe we supposedly have out there? 
(Stories from government agencies and privately owned companies about voyages and orbiting satellites, space missions, etc..)

Assuming "overpopulation" was the cause for creating death..
What about the fact that we haven't truly overpopulated this planet yet?..
Not even close.. (With the consideration that others' greed is the only thing preventing all these families and places from being more inhabited.)

So if death is to keep us from overpopulating.. Why is there such a vast universe out there? To expand into.. To break through "limits" to reach.. To forever explore.. To learn to inhabit..

That's the only real question I have when it comes to this. I don't claim to know much about religion or the bible or any of that, as I'm agnostic.. I believe that a book created by man will never and has never been "God's word" as it has been put through too many hands of men and we know the nature of men..

I do believe it's interesting to think about and discuss though! Very well-written post, keep the interesting content up, this is the type of stuff that's eye-opening and mind-expanding! Love it! :)
👍  , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , ,
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@kainmarx ·
$0.47
I believe death had to be created so that no (human) evil could live forever.. So that no sin could truly continue to persist.. As in, those who wish to do bad, will eventually all have to die.. Leaving less bad and less negative in the world.. If we all worked together, raising new generations on ideals that could work.. We could potentially run sin out of the human bloodline.. Just a thought as well. :)
👍  , ,
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@nicholas83 ·
But @kainmarx, everyone dies. Even so-called good people.
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@pksam9 ·
The universe is great, of course.!
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@iamrosallie ·
$1.34
@kainmarx Yes, there is such a vast universe out there but as of the moment, people are still living in a planet called earth. We may haven't truly overpopulated this planet yet but we already abused our resources.  We consume more than what we needed. If there is no death, just imagine what will earth looks like. 

Have you seen Soylent Green?  If you haven't, I highly recommend it. It was a 1973 film but the content of that film is evergreen. The movie shows how the earth looks like in the future and how overpopulated they are. In a week they are only given a gallon of water per person. It's an all around water so people no longer showers. Lakes, rivers, and the like no longer exists nor trees, grass, and flowers. I don't even remember seeing any other animals aside from rats. The only food they have is biscuits. There are a green, yellow, and red biscuits. People's favorites are the green biscuits. It was given to them freely by the government but after distributions bulldozer visits and take as many people as they can. Fast forward... a detective accidentally found out that his and other people's favorite green biscuits are made of humans.
👍  , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , ,
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@gavvet ·
yummy
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@gavvet ·
Infant mortality rates were very high in past millennia, remove that from the equation and you would have a vastly different scenario on this earth well before possible space travel.
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@quabena ·
Very good point there, what also comes to mind is why GOD will specifically Tell man  to fill or populate the earth
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@ghasemkiani ·
Reblogged — let’s promote quality content!
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@migzillion ·
$1.32
I agree with this fully. I think we as humans have an attachment to life that makes us fear death and see it as this looming evil, but really, we are here consuming energy, consuming life for 80 odd years, we should be proud in knowing our bodies will become the energy  and nutrients that feeds the earth. It's all a cycle of which we are such a tiny segment - so live or die just be grateful to exist right now!
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@vangelov ·
Wow man this article is something else:D 
Love the multiplication scheme :D 

![Untitled-1.png](https://steemitimages.com/DQmWmWADG7aAiSWXTKkQUeQicXgTy8bQQKrtPEp3EeZuvCz/Untitled-1.png)
👍  
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@sanjeetkumar20 · (edited)
wow really its a good post I upvoted
keep it up
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@athenabree08 · (edited)
It may be harsh or unsettling to hear,and I'm not trying to be uncaring or mean, but that is life. Everything in life has a beginning and an end. It's a circle or a cycle if you will. Can you imagine being exactly where you are now, forever, as in infinity. How would we progress as a society if nothing ever stopped, to allow change, to teach us,or to let us evolve and grow as people? Sometimes it's for the better. We can't force life, we actually make it better.

Really an eye-opener. Thanks for sharing @gavvet FOLLOWED YOU. 
👍  
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@olayar ·
I think we learn the most when we are close to death.... But without the limitations of our own existence I do not think we would seek to live life as fully as we do... some more than others of course.
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@alexander.alexis · (edited)
$1.36
Interpreting this post as a kind of argument, I have the following to say:

First, you seem to be conflating death with aging. For instance, in your first several sections, you present an argument for why death is necessary. Let's say we grant you that: death is necessary. But then you go on to say that "This is to cut down the amount of competition for resources between parents and the next generation." Well here's a way to cut down on the competition: have the kids die. 

I mean, there are organisms that, for all we know, are immortal. Whether you (a) keep on living, or (b) have two children that each share 50% of your DNA and then die, or (c) have one child that shares 100% of your DNA and then die, is all the same. So why pick the second way?

In other words, you haven't explained aging. You have explained death. But death can be achieved in a number of ways (a, b, c), parents dying (b) being just one of them.

Secondly, I think you may have put the cart before the horse. Animals reproduce more when they die more, they don't die more because they reproduce more. In other words, if elephants had a very successful predator that killed most of their offspring, or if they had rich food sources, then elephants would adjust by producing more offspring to offset the killing of the offspring by the predator, or to take advantage of the rich food sources.

Third, though this may be the second point reversed, if resources are scant, one possible adaptation is for nature to make the rats/bacteria/fish to produce less offspring, so there won't be as much competition between the offspring. 

Fourth, you're treating death as some sort of force of nature, keeping numbers in check, but it's unclear how it works. To me it's just self-evidently true that no organism can grow beyond the environment's ability to sustain that growth. There's no need to bring death into the picture, it's more like a metaphor.

> Simply, from a Darwinian perspective, the purpose of an organism is to be born, reproduce some offspring that are slight variations of themselves and then exit the scene as quickly as possible.
This is to cut down the amount of competition for resources between parents and the next generation. The faster the cycle can repeat itself, the faster the environment will select for better adaptions and the species will evolve.

I think this is false. It sounds like teleology. I don't think creatures aim to evolve. I don't think mutations happen with foresight, or purpose. If the environment has been stable for a long time, cells that tend to make errors in copying themselves will disappear, since by definition all mutations will be less adaptive (since the environment is stable and we assume adaptation has reached a saturation point). So organisms will tend to produce very faithful versions of themselves. If on the other hand the environment changes often, then either cells making more errors will be favored, or else the same number of errors but more offspring (as in bacteria). But there's no need to talk of purposes: it no more serves an organism to produce variations of itself than it serves a warbler to raise a cuckoo.
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@gavvet ·
>Well here's a way to cut down on the competition: have the kids die.

Sure, the competition is decreased, but so are the chances of the species survival if the environment changes for the worst... that species will have less variety and potentially beneficial adaptations to survive radical change in environment.

So the question is, does natural selection favor the species that bets on one horse or many, which is more likely to be a successful strategy? It's not that the species picks it or plans it, its just the way selection works.


Strong selection environments will favor species that age and die once they have performed their reproductive duties unless there is some beneficial aspect of having them around for longer. 

More complex and social species that provide added benefit will tend to live longer as a result because selection will favor lines that don't age and die as quickly if the survival benefit of being around longer is significant. 


>In other words, you haven't explained aging.

The purpose of the post was hardly intended to be an exhaustive discourse on evolutionary biology. The discussion was around how feasible immortality is given that reproduction is taking place....

Two questions that come up when evaluating the biblical account of Adam and Eve in the garden of Eden before the fall.

The "argument" as you see it is hardly along the lines you are pursuing.

If I use the word "purpose" its simply for easier readability to a wider audience.

>I don't think creatures aim to evolve.

Correct, none do but those that do have a better chance of survival in a changing environment.
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@alexander.alexis ·
I understand now. We agree. I was just picking on the language I guess.
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@sachumanoj ·
Good job by the author... Cheers 🍻
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@jkiw ·
great post - will make sure to read the previous ones tonight! Followed, resteemed and upvoted - looking forward to reading more :-)
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@theguruasia · (edited)
@gavvet,
Yeah friend you got a good point! So definitely death was alive while Adam and Eva born! You got the extract point and you have proven it very well! The whole system (not only earth, the whole universe) was planned very well. It controlling everything itself. You explained it perfectly! 
All credits goes to you friend!
https://bjorkbloggen.files.wordpress.com/2011/07/adam-och-eva.jpg

Cheers~
👍  
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@abupasi.alachy ·
https://steemit.com/fiction/@abupasi.alachy/apa-itu-bid-ah-dan-penjelasan-tentang-bid-ah-2017917t2217416z.
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@resteemia · (edited)
amigo #resteemia at your service

nice explanation, yes Adam & Eve were immortal & death or reaper already there. nice explanation about the reproduction, natural orders with examples of rats & bacteria @gavvet

ReSteemia
'UpVoted ReSteemed Commented'
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@guarddog ·
Actually I believe Cain introduced death to the world first because of him killing his brother Able. WAIT NO! Thinking this over again it wiukd have been Able who introduced death since he offered animals as a sacrifice on his alter. So yes Able would have introduced death first. Just thoughts from a dog.
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@gavvet ·
Actually a coat  of skins was made for Adam and Eve before they left the garden...
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@guarddog ·
Oh yeah, true that. Wasn't thinking about that.
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@steemwija · (edited)
@gavvet - oh my goodness, you described it in-detailed & you explained with examples Sir. I'm totally agree with your view about this case Sir. The system of nature is controlling everything. So, death introduced to limit every being (not only human being) Sir. You explained it well. Love your work Sir. Therefore, I wish to ReSteem your post. God bless you Sir.

+W+ [UpVoted & ReSteemed]
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@dlina-v-metrah ·
Yes that's right. To multiply, you have to die and die. But I wanted us to live longer - well, at least up to 200 years!
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@pchaudhary ·
Lot of time and effort on this theory man.... Hats off
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@grizzman ·
Interesting write up, something to think about.
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@oluwoleolaide ·
i have no idea how i missed last week series, but my take on if there was death before Adam is this: If God destroyed the first man before creating Adam and Eve out of his Ribs then that is not Death but Extermination.

Or if the first man was not... Just like Enoch!
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@ihuomastephen ·
$1.36
A lot scientific info to digest. Perhaps the creation story is just a metaphor. I don't know but I sure that Adam dying meant he was seperated from the source of life, which is God himself. And in christianity that's what death is really all about. In the book of revelations, it is refered to as the second death: eternal seperation from the creator and giver of life. Great work! Very insightful.
👍  , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , ,
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@kimterje83 ·
$0.46
wondering when did reproduction start ,did eden animal 2 and 2 pairs of all animala in the garden, when did mammals start to haw sexuall reproduction dna genetics.
was there sex before death. was the first creations made witouth the need for death ,if noa was 700 adam even older got two sons, 900 years fucking like rats shorter lifespan more reproduction . was adam a testrun god got bored by so he made more for winnershans of amusment.

anyone thinking like me ,please respond 

love your post will read all and follow
👍  , ,
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@amreshchandra ·
The cold virus just doesn't go off lol
and thanks to Elon Musk, going to Mars could become a reality, possibly a new earth. Well, there may already be similar species elsewhere, or possibly we humans colonized/migrated to earth...it is very difficult to find a common answer to these questions as nobody really know it, we could only hypothesize.
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@gavvet ·
$0.03
Mars is unfortunately a microwave oven...
👍  
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@unethical2017 · (edited)
Great emphasis shown on the inverse relationship between earth and population.
Well described
Keep it up!
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@namct ·
Upvote!  hope you like my story :D
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@boostupvote ·
This post was resteemed by @boostupvote 

 All The Best
👍  
👎  
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@oriana ·
increible historia me gusto
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@rival ·
Thank you, today we had a walk in the national park in Holland the hooge Veluwe. And we discussed the same thing. Death is what nature brings automatically. But the best lesson was.. everything in nature can be answered with 3 words.  Propagation, protection, food. Everything what happens and what animals do can be answered for one of those 3 reasons... We had some examples and this is really true
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@santiago43 ·
dheck out... the Outer Light on YouTube, he covered both of these stories in the last 48 hrs or so.

and @ura-soul just made a post on the Icelandic situation as well.

https://steemit.com/news/@ura-soul/iceland-to-hold-new-election-due-to-prime-minister-s-family-support-for-a-long-term-convicted-child-rapist
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@marzukie ·
Wow.. Very good post,, 
Iam resteemit, follow of you.. 
Thanks for share my friend @gavvet
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@edumurphy ·
$1.32
We can however consider the possibility that anything that evolved or was designed to be immortal would commensurately have either longer gestational periods, fewer offspring (or BOTH) -- or no offspring at all Even in nature in real life, we see that longer lived lifeforms have fewer kids -- case in point, humans. 

Looking further on the immortality front, there's that jellyfish (T. *nutricula* or something) that doesn't die of old age; instead it reverts to earlier stages in its life cycle and grows up again.
👍  , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , ,
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@arzt ·
Interesting post!!! Thanks for sharing it!!!!
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@andyartland ·
$1.36
Damn wasnt especting to read something like this today, gonna follow the series to open my mind a little bit, THANKS FOR SHARING!
👍  , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , ,
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@rizals ·
amazing post...good luck man
👍  
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@bitgeek ·
comment
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@nehab ·
Interesting post. I agree. I have always  believed that what breeds fast dies fast . This is the way universe controls and balances. And everyone and everything contributes to this process of creation and death.  Good post :)
👍  
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@aarellanes ·
$0.09
Dang! Very interesting read! I typically dont read any post with any religious based tags.
👍  ,
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@eliashanna ·
$0.04
only that Adam's story is a metaphore, no?
👍  ,
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@fapapotomus ·
$0.03
No it's a lesson that women will ruin you they will destroy the things you love most FOOTBALL on sundays
👍  ,
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@gavvet ·
$0.03
Perhaps, perhaps not entirely, that's what is being explored here.
👍  
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@danlupi ·
$0.11
really love this article keep u the good work
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@ntony ·
$0.90
Resources on Earth are finite, and the resources of the Universe may be finite too. But the space of the Universe is infinite so a more evolved species, that uses less and less resources may cheat death for a long time.
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@blockgators · (edited)
What are some of the resources you are referring too? I think of food and environmental toxins that are harmful to the human body. Let's say a human ate the correct diet once a day and fast others... Exercised was not subjected to harmful environmental toxins, physical danger etc...  (if this is a good example) given a length of time the average person in this society could live 150 years+???
👍  ,
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@ntony ·
Life uses these resources to resist harmful environment and go beyond.
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@ntony ·
Resources for energy , like food and water. Even the space for living could be a resource if it turns out to be finite.
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@arslanbhatti91 ·
agree
👍  
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@ntony ·
...finite space or just too hard to reach.
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@tiffanyrej ·
$1.37
Nice post @gavvet! Yeah I guess even I can't help but to ask the same question why death is needed to exist. When I was a kid, all I thought is because man committed sin but now when I look at it, if man will be immortal forever, then the Earth will not be big enough for us to fit in it.  Even space will eventually be crowded.
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@olayar ·
$1.36
I would beg to differ I am afraid. My interpretation is that death is needed to sustain life because you need decomposing matter to feed the chain from the bottom up, otherwise we would all starve. Bacteria included.

And the reason why many species produce so much offspring is because the chances of survival of each offspring is really low or their lifespan is really short, and that is rather evident on us humans. The average family only 100 yrs ago could easily produce 7-12 offspring that would live to see 50 maybe. The more developed, the higher the likelyhood of survival and the longer the lifespan, the lower the birth rate.

As for the resource based limitation of numbers... in that, us humans, present a paradox. In some places, excess resources have not resulted in increased populations in 'developed' countries. Whereas in places with high birth rates scarcity of resources (like food and water) continues to increase... 

Thanks for sharing though. Nice to give the neuron a bit of a workout so late in the week!
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@gavvet ·
Those are all valid points too, just not covered in this post. This was more about what would happen if immortals reproduce in a finite environment.
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@quabena ·
Did you say finite environment? Records has it that the earth keeps expanding, and as to How it's happening no one knows
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@rahuljoy ·
I agree with you @gavvet, if all were immortal, then such planets as the Earth would need thousands, or even more :)
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@freedomengineer ·
$0.72
Unlike rats, humans can choose to have fewer children... or zero!

Unlike rats,  humans can use their minds to engineer the universe and create abundance.

I want to live 10,000+ years and the tech to do it is being developed right now.

If you, Dear reader share my interest in #longevity please follow @flc :)
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@arslanbhatti91 ·
righht....\\
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@nofiat ·
$0.05
Agreed @ freedomengineer.   We are God's creation and have been given the gift of discernment, separating us markedly from the animals, should we choose it so.  We are called to be good stewards of the earth, which also includes proper management of resources.  My hope is we will all learn to make better use of our many gifts!
👍  
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@gasaudio ·
sounds good to me
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@amedeo ·
This evolution is simply captivating
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@benyamin ·
Very Nice :)
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@f3nix ·
I really don't understand this article. It should be put under biology for me and not religion. If we talk about Adam and Eve, we should take a biblical perspective. In this perspective, death comes with the original sin. If we take a biological/scientific perspective, the first observation that comes to my mind is that death is a transition from a state to another of energy.
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@pjcswart ·
I agree.
👍  
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@f3nix ·
I think I'm going to start writing articles in "religion" if this is the level of huge feedback for such an article. I don't want to seem an asshole but I had to shoot it out haha
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@benyamin ·
Very Nice Post Thanks :)
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@lizad ·
Very good post. I like. thank for you sharing
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@abasifreke ·
Awesome........really got enlightened.......appreciate,keep it up
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@horus149 ·
https://media.giphy.com/media/3o6Zt5MaLH5KtLix7a/giphy.gif
https://steemit.com/ikigai/@horus149/ikigai-the-reason-to-get-up-in-the-morning
👍  ,
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@khoa ·
<p>This post has received a 0.04 % upvote from @khoa
<img src="http://i995.photobucket.com/albums/af78/khoa007/van_zpsyty4fr4l.jpg" /></p>

<p> thanks to: @dang007.\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
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\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\-SEND ANY AMOUNT TO GET AN UPVOTE\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\</p>
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@pastbastard ·
I consider that some part of me is immortal, the soul if you will. Without the trappings of flesh it could be in bliss (heaven) or suffering (hell). It must have emanated from some archetypal place (Eden?)....
👍  
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@abieikram ·
Amazing post,,  im like that @gavvet
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@spellmaker ·
We're all one big process happening all the time no matter what you choose to perceive. It's up to you!
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@suekyuri ·
Do everything well when you are alive ^^
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@rarcntv ·
Hi. I am not sure. first time you response. me and 2nd and 3rd time you do not response. so if no response. you should refund what you get. and you can note. do not send you anything. so I ca understand.
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@nasrol ·
As a lay man I can't interpret this painting with pragmatism, but I look at this painting brings us a very meaningful message for life. Where the living need peace and protect each other.
#Salam have known uncle ...
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@jacsnuffles ·
@gavvet this article captured my attention. And your article is worth reading. My only reaction to this is : " Our God, has plans for everything. The forbidden fruit was also planned. Adam and Eve lived longer because God planned to give them longer life. And so as death."  Your article and research has given us a more elaborated explanation. Thank you.
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@miky ·
$0.09
According to Abrahamic religious teachings, the children of Adam and Eve were born twins, that is, every baby boy was born together with a baby girl. Adam marries his son with his daughter who is not her twin.

According to Ibn Humayd, Ibn Ishaq, and Salamah, the sons of Adam are Qabil and Iqlima, Abel and Labuda, Sith and Azura, Ashut and his sister Ayad and his sister, Balagh and his sister, Athati and his sister Tawbah his women, Darabi and his sister Hadaz and his sister, Yahus and his sister, Sandal and his sister, and Baraq and his sister. The total number of Adam's children is 40.
👍  , ,
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@joeyarnoldvn ·
interesting
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@blockgators ·
Where did you gain such knowledge? What book? I would like to read it to gain insight about Adam. I know that there are many religions that fall under the Abrahamic religious teachings but I do not know their names.
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@darlenys01 ·
It is very interesting your exhibition, but I believe that they are mysteries of the creation that only God could explain, we humans are very logical and we take by the chrono time, the chronological time, but the time has God. The bible says that sin entered the world through a man and with it death, also says that we were created to live forever, in fact when you look in the word it is said that Adam and Eve lived many years.

Another interesting point is that they lived in the Eden and there was the Glory of God, which was that which made it eternal, when they sinned God sent angels guardians to take care of that Glory, but flashes of it remained in their bodies and that the he lived for more than six hundred years.

Then came the Plan of Redemption through Jesus, but that glory was extinguished until we were as we are now, mortal bodies, finite, that in this presentation we can not see God in His majesty. Only to communicate with Him through the Spirit. We can never contend with the omnipotent but the word says that only the Father decides will be revealed the secrets of the Kingdom.
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@alansary1234 ·
great post
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@joeyarnoldvn ·
Life is demanded more because of death. That is supply & demand. We can study the laws of economics, of supply & demand. If there was no death, there would be no sickness either. Sickness is a transition towards death. Animals reproduce because they're limited through death.
.
We live in a world with death & that is all we know. We could assume that natural laws would be the same without death but that would still be an assumption.
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@blackjellyfish13 ·
$0.51
If hell and heaven exists, does it mean that hell and heaven has over population issues too? I mean, everyone dies and it's either you go to heaven or go to hell.


Anyway, thank you for the well thought post. This post made me think.
👍  , ,
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@yoda1917 ·
$0.13
Nothing makes sense if we apply the limitations of human science to bigger questions....
👍  ,
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@nikethemutt ·
$1.36
(First, I apologize in advance if I've stumbled over issues discussed in your earlier debates.  I just recently found this topic and it looked very interesting to me.  I will endeavor to try and read all of the previous discussions.)

I guess I fall into your third category.  You know, one of those that:
"dogmatically to the idea that Adam was the first to introduce death into the world and that anything (meaning the eaten fruit) that transpired before that was magically or miraculously taken care of".

Going back to the last post, No, there was no death in the world until Adam "sinned against God"  (eating the fruit was the outward manifestation of his inner disobedience to God.  That may sound harsh, but then there was only one rule in the entire world, and like every rule ever made, there was a good reason behind it.)

Romans 5:12 states “Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:”

The reason I'm rehashing last week's question is because I disagree with many of your premises, premises that have been carried over to this week.

You statement, paraphrased, that if Adam hadn't sinned, God would have "magically" or "miraculously" "taken care of things" seems somewhat dismissive of the concept.  On one hand, you seem to be allowing that Adam was the first man, the Garden of Eden was a real place, the Earth (and universe) were created in a literal 6 days through God's power, and yet somehow controlling the growth of rats and bacteria is somehow an unbelievable feat for the Creator of the universe.

If you do not or cannot believe the  biblical account as 100% factual (even by faith for the parts you don't understand), then the questions are moot because there will always be parts that we do not or cannot understand and it's easy to sit back and ask questions like "is death a necessity" or "if God can do all things, can He create a rock so big and heavy that He can't lift it?"

I know that makes me sound simplistic to those who may not believe as I do, but that can be said about anyone that does not believe the way another believes.

That said, that does not mean that I am incapable of conjecturing what "might have been" if things had gone differently.   I've often toyed with the idea of how things could have turned out differently.

I've often joked what if Adam hadn't eaten the fruit after Eve had already eaten.  (here is where I get called a sexist, but 1Tim 2:4 states that Adam was not deceived, as Eve was, but he went along with it anyway).  Would God have created another woman?  Would the "sinlessly perfect" men desire to be with the "sinful fallen women" or would it have been the end of the line for Eve?  What if Adam and Eve had not sinned, but one or more of their children had fallen?  

Or what if none had ever fallen and they grew to populate the entire Earth?  Perhaps we would have gone to other planets (I mean, after all, God DID create an entire universe, it seems kind of a waste to make all that if we're going to be stuck on this little ball of dirt).

Let's take it a step further....How do we know for sure he hasn't created other worlds with other people who faced the same test with differing outcomes???

I can still believe the Word of God 100% and still toy around with these notions.   The fact that I do not understand does not mean that it is not true.  The fact it has not been spelled out for me does not make it impossible.  It's faith (and I know that answer seems like a cop out to many).  Oh well.

Thanks for the mental gymnastics.
👍  , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , ,
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@gavvet ·
>You statement, paraphrased, that if Adam hadn't sinned, God would have "magically" or "miraculously" "taken care of things" seems somewhat dismissive of the concept. On one hand, you seem to be allowing that Adam was the first man, the Garden of Eden was a real place, the Earth (and universe) were created in a literal 6 days through God's power, and yet somehow controlling the growth of rats and bacteria is somehow an unbelievable feat for the Creator of the universe.

I think you need to read **all** the posts that precede this one...

>I've often joked what if Adam hadn't eaten the fruit after Eve had already eaten. (here is where I get called a sexist, but 1Tim 2:4 states that Adam was not deceived, as Eve was, but he went along with it anyway). Would God have created another woman? Would the "sinlessly perfect" men desire to be with the "sinful fallen women" or would it have been the end of the line for Eve? What if Adam and Eve had not sinned, but one or more of their children had fallen?

I might get into these types of questions in the next couple of posts.

>I can still believe the Word of God 100% and still toy around with these notions. The fact that I do not understand does not mean that it is not true. The fact it has not been spelled out for me does not make it impossible. It's faith (and I know that answer seems like a cop out to many). Oh well.

agreed, and that is what I am doing with this series...
👍  ,
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@troilo ·
I'm wondering since a long time how do you insert the "quotes" like you did? Thanks :)
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@mrblu · (edited)
amen to that @nikethemutt, in the bible verse

John 1New International Version (NIV)

The Word Became Flesh
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning. 
3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 
4 In him was life, and that life was the light of all mankind.
 5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome[a] it.

6 There was a man sent from God whose name was John. 
7 He came as a witness to testify concerning that light, so that through him all might believe. 8 He himself was not the light; he came only as a witness to the light.

9 The true light that gives light to everyone was coming into the world. 
10 He was in the world, and though the world was made through him, the world did not recognize him. 11 He came to that which was his own, but his own did not receive him. 
12 Yet to all who did receive him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God— 
13 children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband’s will, but born of God.

14 The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. 
We have seen his glory, the glory of the one and only Son, 
who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.

15 (John testified concerning him. He cried out, saying, 
“This is the one I spoke about when I said,
‘He who comes after me has surpassed me because he was before me.’”)
 16 Out of his fullness we have all received grace in place of grace already given. 
17 For the law was given through Moses; grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.
 18 No one has ever seen God, but the one and only Son, who is himself God and[b] is in closest relationship with the Father, has made him known.

on @gavvet topic

the question is what if adam did not eat the forbidden fruit? , as conclude based on technical aspect of our human  mind of understanding, the planet will be over populated with all living things,i'm wonder God the creature, the most High created also many planets around the universe,therefore, the lord will migrate some human and living things on the other planet to reproduce more. see how the lord God  our creature is so powerful..this my human mind understand and conclusion also as we talk about the said topic.

thanks for sharing @gavvet.


kindly see my post..https://steemit.com/teamsouthafrica/@mrblu/the-love-of-the-lord-is-great-this-message-sent-to-south-africa
P.s 

@mrblu
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@maivantruong ·
so magical
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@razor80 ·
no wonder
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@owner99 · (edited)
Good effort @gavvet Adam is a prophet created by God lifted from heaven to the world for eating the fruit of the khuldi. Because he ate the fruit that was forbidden by God then Adam was expelled into the world, and his spouse was his wife created by God from Adam's left rib, therefore we men lacked the ribs on the left. from that, respect and keep women. because they are a part of us. For the history of adam more precise and accurate. open al-qur'an let me not misunderstand its history.

natural human on the earth more women than men, according to the biology of marriage of female eggs with male sperm occurs due to improper timing. The age of male sperm cells lasts only 24 hours from the sperm is removed, while female sperm cells last 3x24 hours.
👍  ,
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@crypto-futurist ·
$0.28
Ultimately, all biological living elements are information processing elements that increases entropy of the Universe through reproduction. The ultimate goal of evolution is to process information better (e.g. humans better than apes) and evolve. That's why in future, we may merge our biological bodies with machines and may live forever to process information of the Universe. Foretold story of Adam without death will fulfill in reverse way.
👍  , ,
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@basicstoliving ·
$1.36
I believe death was always figured into life. If nothing died the earth would never be able to sustain everything on it.
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@cityboy ·
Nice post @gavvet the use of mouse in this post is an great concept
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@nicholas83 ·
$1.35
@gavvet. For me, the issue of death has to do with how it is perceived. And that perception is one that is dictated by our institutions, especially the religious ones. We can agree that there is nothing wrong with being sick or dying. You mentioned that it would be impossible for everything to go on. A more fundamental question, however, is, if we could postpone our deaths indefinitely, we would not. This is not how we, collectively, have sought to evolve. Death is the way maker, and birth is renewal. But we have been taught to fear death. It is a terrible disease from which our culture suffers. This I think is the main issue and it is something that I will be writing about not long from now. That said thanks for this post. It gives one something to think about.
👍  , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , ,
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@parash ·
interesting ,
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@lordkingpotato ·
The key here is the length of time man reproduce. If ever we are immortals I think the balancing factor to avoid overpopulation is to lengthen the time for reproduction. Scale 9 months to a factor n. N might be 1 thousand, 1 million and so on... If you think that at a time close to infinity the earth would still be crowded then just scale 'n' to a number closer to a larger infinity. If you ever read this please don't laugh at me. Haha. Thanks for a wonderful post :)
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@arslanbhatti91 ·
best unique post ever
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@sureshgajera ·
Agree
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@nomishiekh ·
Great and good work 🌸🌸
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@micgacusan ·
This is exemplified in the Disney Classic, "The Lion King." #CircleOfLife # HakunaMatata
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@optimisticguy ·
I followed you. Please follow me too. Follow me and I will follow you anywhere. @optimisticguy
👎  
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@hoosain ·
There is only one way in and one out of this world, in through birth and out through death. The globalists created this idea of space travel and an infinite universe to push their atheists agendas. The earth was created as a testing ground for us to prove ourselves worthy of entering paradise.
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@abupasi.alachy ·
https://steemit.com/fiction/@abupasi.alachy/apa-itu-bid-ah-dan-penjelasan-tentang-bid-ah-2017917t2217416z
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@simonfinkelstein ·
there was mortality before Adam without infinite awareness.

After Adam the "gods" gave us infinite awareness .

The "gods" have immortality and infinite awareness
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@cyclope ·
$0.51
Muy buena deducción y los demas temas muy intresantes!!!
👍  ,
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vote details (2)
@muliadi ·
Nice post


https://steemit.com/food/@muliadi/tips-membuat-pizza-2017917t191235507z
See this link i need your advice
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@wayforhappiness ·
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vote details (2)
@sharadkotadia ·
agree
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@aldentan ·
$1.37
You know, I just gotta say first, I just got back from a tiring day at work. I was pissed off on the way home because of the crowd in the buses and trains. 

Then I came home to read this and instantly felt relief. Society is all work and stress, and reading these philosophical matters is a great break.

So thanks @gavvet.

Anyway, I can't really say  much about the purpose of death except that we aren't supposed to perfectly know the purpose.

People like to say, "Things for a reason."

Well, sometimes that reason is that we aren't supposed to know the reason.

That's it. Death no matter what, will always be a mystery for every living person has not crossed over yet.
👍  , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , ,
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vote details (19)
@sajedul04 ·
hi, nice to read about you.
i am, sajedul ahmed, from bangladesh,am also new on steemit and welcome you to steemit.
i have followed you. so, can also follow me plz.and plz upvoted my post.
best of luck...
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@sokoloffa ·
My God, I never thought in this direction. Very interesting reasoning. To my great chagrin, I missed your first part))) Now you need to find time and read your entire story))) Thanks, I was interested))
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@truth-be-told ·
$0.25
What if the intent of Adam and his descendants was to replace the fallen angels that Lucifer brought down with him.  If that was the purpose, then Lucifer would have a HUGE motivation to destroy us (humans).    Lucifer, being jealous of God, must not have been too pleased that He made man "...in the image of God..."  

Lucifer could have chosen to hate any other planet and creation of God, but he chose to hate us.
👍  
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vote details (1)
@muhazir ·
I like his photo very good
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@rooneey · (edited)
$0.27
Adam is the first creature of God...most of people believe that, except Darwin who has crazy theory that man derived from an ape.
👍  , , , , , , , , , ,
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vote details (11)
@rollycustodio1 ·
$1.36
According to the Bible. In book of Ezekiel, that Lucifer who is called Satan after he reveal against God from heaven was thrown here on Earth including all the black angels or demons. It is estimated that 1/3 of Angels in Heaven go with Lucifer. When Lucifer and One third of Angels were thrown on Earth the Earth was void and empty. It's very clear that there in no people before Adam and it's only Angels in heaven are alive. I believed if there are human being or people before Adam they will not die they were immortal but according to the Bible there were no people live on earth before Adam and Ever. According tot he Book of Genesis When Adam was created by God by taking the clay/soil form of a man and God breath on his nostril cause that soil/clay become living creature and God called him Adam, And while Adam is alive in Garden of Eden He is immortal why? He did not committed sin. Sin is stepping against the law of God and after years passed Adam was lone and God created Eve our of his womb and that is why God called her woman because she is created from the womb of a man. It is very clear that before God gave commandment to them Adam and Eve is immortal but the moment they violate the law of God which Gods says Do not eat the fruit of good and evil on the tree at center of the garden and God said if you eat that fruits of good and evil you will surely die which means on that moment before violating the law of God of not to eat that fruits of good and evil they are immortal. They became mortal when they follow Satan in the Garden. Because the Serpen who is Satan twist the commandment of God by saying if you eat that fruits of good and evil you will surely not die but you will become like GOD. When Eve heard that she tried to eat and give some to Adam. So that's scene that she eat and Adam also eat they become mortal and God told them Now you can't eat any foods here in Paradize but you surely work and produce foods. Adam and Eve were thrown out of paradise and God told them you become mortal and the Book of Psalm said your life is numbered up to 70 only average.
👍  , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , ,
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vote details (20)
@outhori5ed ·
great point; But here is my opinion. Dont forget that we are looking at this from the point of documentation.

The Maker of any product knows exactly how the product will function. He provides its functions also. If this is correct, since God only released death as a punishment for disobedience using these words "till you return unto the ground" Gen 3:19, that simply shows that death was NOT in the original manuscript of man.

Romans 5:17 says "For if, by the trespass of the one man, DEATH reigned through that one man, how much more will those who receive God's abundant provision of grace and of the gift of righteousness reign in life through the one man, Jesus Christ!"

Remember that man is originally made in the image of God and in His likeness...so if heaven is not overpopulated and if death do not reign in heaven, it can be established that heaven on earth was Eden and everything that happens in heaven was permitted on earth. 'thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven' in the Lord's prayer connotes that there is a lifestyle different from the lifestyle on earth.

I have never read that an angel died in Heaven or an elder or one of the 4 beasts. this to me means that Adam was not created to die because spirits dont die...but however, after living consciously in the flesh, the Lord (Maker) reprogramed man (His product) to suit was he was not originally designed for.

with the original purpose, Eden or the earth wouldnt have been overpopulated. 

if you permit me, i will conclude with this, 'Death is an addendum'; it is not in the original plan. if it was, i believe that it would have been stated as a purpose for man when he was created.

Thank you for the opportunity to share this.
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@arquiatra ·
Excellent point of view, I agree 100%
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@fproductions ·
https://steemitimages.com/0x0/https://ci.memecdn.com/10324462.jpg
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@arcange ·
Congratulations @gavvet!
Your post was mentioned in the [hit parade](https://steemit.com/hit-parade/@arcange/daily-hit-parade-20170917) in the following categories:

* Upvotes - Ranked 5 with 583 upvotes
* Comments - Ranked 3 with 172 comments
* Pending payout - Ranked 2 with $ 277,62
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@biwash ·
Nice photo
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@hurghada ·
There were no death before Adam and Eve because there were only Angles in the heaven who are immortals.
Also in this world there are three types of souls: Humans, Angles and Jenn. 
The humans beeing in this world for a short time life then they die then their souls go the heaven  to see their place in the immortal life which callled  " the life of the Ismuth" then they raise up from their garves to the " counting day" then they face their distny whether the Paradise which is made to the people who made a good deeds in their life, or go to the Hill fire which is made to the people who didn't follow the rules of their religion.
The humans under test freely if they did a good deeds sobthey will gobto the paradise but if they didn't sovthey will go to the hill fire. They can't see the angles nor the Jenn.
As for Angles, they all will be a live untill the day of resuriction, their work only to keep praising the God and some if them have a special work like Angel Azrael who is working as the Angel of death " who taking the souls when their lifes is finished"
And Angel  Gebrael who is responsible of the reveleation and a special angles who alwayes acompany the human while he is in this life to write everything he do whether the good or nad and many others.
The Angles , they are not under test l, they only do what they ordered from God. The humans never see them.
As for Jenn, they under test from God too but tehy are different than humans in theree things: 
1:they live in between the layers of earth
2:they can see humans but the humans not.
3: they live longer than the humans.
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@wayforhappiness ·
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@charlesmore143 ·
love this
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@hurghada ·
Thanks  Charlesmore 143.
Thats kind of you!
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@gailbelga ·
This gave me another point of view to think about such issue.
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@junaid.chuqtai ·
$0.26
Looks authentic! Really it's been such a long time since human birth and see we are right now!! ✌️Thanks for sharing man!
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@mcmm ·
Very interesting series! Being an apprentice theologian and interest in the biological cycle I'll have to go through the series. Nice heady thought provoking subject!
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@vangelov ·
Hey @gavvet ! Hope you having a lovely day :) 

I was wondering if you could extend a helping hand and make a small upvote on 

https://steemit.com/steemit/@vangelov/s-w-g-or-steemit-writers-guild-helping-you-make-passive-income

This is a project I'm working on that has the potential to help people make passive income and hopefully invest in steem. 

It would mean a lot to me <3 Thank you !
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@madeve ·
Thanks for sharings. When we are too busy with our life , we tend to forget most of the things deemed important in life. You made a good sharing about this and would love to read more . Cheers from Borneo. @madeve
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@sajedul04 ·
hi, nice to read about you.
i am, sajedul ahmed, from bangladesh,am also new on steemit and welcome you to steemit.
i have followed you. so, can also follow me plz.and plz upvoted my post.
best of luck...
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@hendra.rv12297 ·
hello friends. I'm a new user here I want your help all to teach me how to properly use this steemit. thanks . please follow me @hendra.rv12297
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@thehackweb ·
https://www.tenor.co/vX2T.gif![](https://steemitimages.com/DQmbKPsr4EcQqk9wmuhzV61u2w8XwvhWxA75ibYTPFp5wkH/image.png)
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@watertoncafe · (edited)
$1.31
The biological purpose of Fruit is and was to die. Fruit has life, to eat fruit would mean death for that fruit in the sense that it would cease to exist as a living fruit.  

Its life energy passed to Adam and Eve when they ate the fruit.  In its death the fruit helped Adam and Eve to live.   In the process that fruit would "die". 

![](http://i64.tinypic.com/ri51xj.jpg)

And in the end the seeds of that fruit would return to the earth and give birth to a new fruit tree that would in time and in season give birth to more fruit.  A cycle of Life and Death and Rebirth. 

Therefore, yes, death existed at the time of Adam and Eve and it existed for a biological purpose.

Geneisis 1:29 Then God said, “I give you every seed-bearing plant on the face of the whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it. They will be yours for food.  [New International Version >  https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=genesis+1%3A29&version=NIV]
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vote details (12)
@arquiatra ·
$1.35
Hello friends...
I found this post in "trends" and I was struck by the topic they deal with. After reading for a while, I concluded that in order to understand the purpose of the topic I should read the previous posts, and I have done so.
I want to clarify that I do not pretend to be theologian or anything like that, so what I write here is only my humble opinion of what I have learned and read from and in the bible. From the book of Genesis to the Apocalypse, we can note the existence of a thread that unites or interweaves each verse, every prophecy, every principle or law, as well as every theme there narrated and every spiritual truth expressed; this thread is what constitutes the eternal purpose of God revealed in Christ Jesus. That is, the purpose of God is in creation and redemption. There was an Adam who represents humanity and if he had never sinned and would not have had to leave Eden, we would not be discussing this issue today, nor any other that would allow us to question and decide whether or not we believe.
Now the point is that Adam sinned and lost all the privileges God had bestowed upon him, but since God's purpose is eternal and the desire of his heart is that man, his ultimate creation, be able to dwell eternally with Him, justice gave man the ability to choose, what we call "free will." In other words, God's desire is for man to dwell eternally with Him, but it must be a voluntary act and not an imposition. That is why, just as there was a first Adam, through whom the separation from God occurred, second type of Adam represented in Jesus Christ is the reunification of man and God, is the bridge that eliminates that separation. As Adam represents the created humanity, Christ represents the new spiritual humanity.
Thanks for this opportunity.
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vote details (21)
@oneray ·
La muerte biológica siempre estuvo presente en los seres vivos. No importaba cuan longevos podían ser, siempre llegaría el cese de sus funciones vitales, porque desde el principio, el ser humano fue creado de esa manera. Y morirían al cumplir el propósito que les fue asignado, así como hoy nosotros.
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@pjcswart ·
Interesting. Thank you for your interesting posts! I hope you have a wonderful, wonderful day! 😃
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@jaki01 ·
$3.78
Some time ago I wrote an <a href="https://steemit.com/science/@jaki01/human-immortality">article</a> about one of the biological reasons why we have to die.

There I also pointed out that the concept to die and give ones genes to the next generation most of the time seems to be superior in evolution compared to the concept of immortality (which <a href="http://www.pnas.org/content/109/11/4209.abstract">actually exists</a> as well). The reason for that is that it allows to adapt more easily to a changing environment according to the motto <a href="http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0024328">"we age because the world changes"</a> - also <a href="http://www.spiegel.de/wissenschaft/mensch/neue-computersimulation-altern-macht-die-menschheit-staerker-a-795152.html">computer simulations</a> seem to confirm that.
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vote details (5)
@soul.searching · (edited)
Wow, this was truly marvelous to read. Now, in a way I found it slightly difficult to wrap my mind around a lot of this... Perhaps I haven't thought about it this way? Now that I have read your post quite a few times, I understand what you mean. And you have a miraculous brain. That's what I have to say. You have given me something to seriously consider. Thank you very much for this post!

I am fairly new to the Steemit community, but am so enjoying posts such as yours, that truly give the reader something to think about!!!! <3 Upvoted & followed... I can't wait for more of your posts.

Best wishes to you,

Stephanie
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vote details (2)
@aaqib11b ·
$0.27
Evolution is infact not a real thing at all...Darwin at last himself dismissed that MONKEY FIASCO story
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@mithunasiriphong ·
yes i love animal
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@omirarevalo ·
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@onlinedoit ·
The answer is in Holy Quran
👍  
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vote details (1)
@michaellynn ·
Find it really interesting how you can talk about the biological evolution down to smallest organism but still think that we were just poofed into existence, and that there was a perfect land  at some point. The whole fall story is simultaneously paradoxical. You sound much like me and my father trying to figure out the real ins and outs of whats litteral and not in the bible. When in the end with enough digging on who put it together and whats true in what story snd what stories are based off older stories ect you learn its not relevant to actual modern life and can not be trust as truth. 

Ill never forget seeing the teue belief in a muslim seeing maricals from god. When christian jist as devoted will say the same with the same blind faith convictions. The truth in seeing those maricles is no more true than stories that gave each the belief it was even possible a outside fource was subtly effecting their lives in a positive or negative way.

Quiet honestly id love to hear your opinion on experiences people have on ayahuasca, peypte, mushrooms, san Pedro, dmt, ect. Natual, safe substances that grow from earth. What of the content of their experiences?
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@nateq ·
$1.37
From what I can read in Genesis, there was no procreating of humans until we ate the forbidden fruit.

The first passage I saw mentioning bearing children is right when God is scolding them for eating the fruit and kicking them out of Eden. God tells Eve how now she will bear children and how Adam will have to earn from the sweat of his brow. (Genesis 3: 1-20)
👍  , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , ,
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vote details (20)
@awgbibb ·
Just for interests sake the Same English University that came up with the " Big Bang Theory"  , came up with an even more "Wonderful Idea"? Old Age and Death is a Disease and they will find the " Cure"
I can only imagine there are a lot of aging Wealthy People desperately making contributions!
BTW the best part of the Big Bang Theory, was the TV series!
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@world-travel-pro ·
Like predicted, your answer was way more thought out than mine, yet kind of on the same line of thought. Well done! Like usual ;)
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@mehdikh19 ·
what post nice information is historical post thanks for sharing wish the best for you and your family
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@mecherine ·
we should believe in biblical stories with faith. Religion is all about faith, no one can claim to be sure of all biblical history without faith. Some say that there is element of politics in religion. So we have to enter the bus without knowing exactly of what is written on it. Nice one @gavvet
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@thedamus ·
Whoa! My mind just got blown...

Umm, err, yeah...
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@lklab2013 ·
I came to think about death.
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@vimalsambath ·
@gavvet afraica is heaevn place to live , this forest gives everthing natural and healthy and lovely felling , nature gives everthing ,but the man kind is waste everthing  and if the nature against people of they will  undersatnd the power of nature . WONDERFULL INFO@gavvet
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@positivesteem ·
$0.12
There are many perspectives to this issue. From a biological point of view, resources are limited, and may not be able to cope with an ever increasing population with death. From a spiritual point of view, God is infinite and He can make resources infinite.
👍  
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vote details (1)
@bat-junior ·
If I may say @gavvet, the mother earth will always find her way to balance. I believe there is life before Adam and Eve, but nature had its calls for revolution. Thanks for this. I learnt a lot
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@adoelesteem ·
help me upvote
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@umerfarooq ·
Alike every film death is like a climax!
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@keyss ·
But then if people would live forever, plants would live forever as well...
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@eco-alex ·
sometimes the answer to the most profound question is very simple! right, yes!
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@american-pie ·
Nice post . Thanks for sharing it @gavvet
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@magh ·
Exceptional knowledge and comparison, I have not finished reading your reviews about The evolution of Adam. I just hope one day, write a special article for you, about The evolution of Adam, in the form of input, about Adam from the view of some religions. Thank for sharing @gavvet
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@anne.ray24236 ·
Thats a interesting post.
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@cesarx321 ·
Thanks, I follow you and if you can help me with an upvote please
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@belgarath ·
Hi @gavvet, great post! Upvoted!

On a similar note, Isaac Asimov wrote about [Solaria](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solaria), a planet in which humans build very efficient robots and many of them (10K per human), they also find a way to extend their life very much. 

And the endgame is that they become very isolationist and stop reproducing. So their already very small number (20K at inception) reduced eventually (when the hero of the novel arrives on the planet) to few thousand. 

This utopia/distopia is when a system that tries to avoid the issues you highlight (population explosion) by stop reproducing.

I love these debates posts and tried to start a few of my own, I would love to hear what you think if you had the time: 
[Economics Specialists](https://steemit.com/life/@belgarath/debatable-ideas-2-economic-specialists)
[Value of Education](https://steemit.com/life/@belgarath/debetable-ideas-1-do-you-prefer-an-ivy-league-degree-or-an-ivy-league-education-signalling-vs-human-capital-value-of-education)
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max_accepted_payout1,000,000.000 SBD
percent_steem_dollars10,000