RE: License or Liberty? by erh.germany

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Viewing a response to: @vieira/re-erhgermany-re-vieira-license-or-liberty-20181016t222055004z

· @erh.germany · (edited)
$0.03
Thank you for taking care of my comment. No problem, when you answer late. 

> And omissions are also important, because in some way, omissions are actions. When we don't do anything, when we omit doing something, we are also deciding not to do anything, and that decision is an action, therefore, when we decide not to do anything, we must also take responsibility for not doing anything, and in the same way, if we don't do anything, and someone takes responsibility for the results propitiated because we did not do anything, then we lack freedom, because we depend on someone else being responsible for our omission, that is, we depend on someone else allowing us, by taking responsibility for our results, to do nothing.

I understand. For example, if I am absent from the vote of the parent representatives in my son's class (my decision not to go, therefore doing nothing for or against), then I do not cast my vote and must therefore be satisfied that others have had a say for me. Utilizing my participation potential is an action, just as not utilizing it is an action (omitted decision). 

> I think that dependence and freedom can only go hand in hand while dependence is mutual, otherwise, and if one of the two depends absolutely on the other without the latter being dependent on the first, one party will be left without responsibility for their acts, as well as without freedom to act in their own way.

This is truly difficult to investigate. The question is: where does the dependence lie and what kind of dependence do we talk about? Can you give an example? 

Regarding "license": When I have the freedom to ignore a license because I just can afford not to use something which the license is about, I still have a certain amount of freedom, hence, can pick alternatives. Do you have something in mind which lets me be unfree? Like the Monsanto strategy, for example? As I have understood it, the farmers don't have to buy seeds from them but once they decide doing so, they depend on purchasing the seeds as they were modified not to reproduce themselves. So it's not quite a fitting example. 

I agree with the rest. Nobody indeed is a hundred percent free. 
The will to become hundred percent free is the problem a lot of the times, I guess. 

One must develop some negotiation skills in order to stretch freedom to the most possible amount. 
... But hey, now I can see where the unfreedom takes place. It's, when the party with which I actually would like to negotiate is out of my reach! Either through willful ignorance or through the sheer size of an organization... there I need representatives to work for "me". ... Here comes trust into play.... what a difficult topic that is ;-)

Sincere greetings to you!
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@vieira ·
$0.04
>I understand. For example, if I am absent from the vote of the parent representatives in my son's class (my decision not to go, therefore doing nothing for or against), then I do not cast my vote and must therefore be satisfied that others have had a say for me. Utilizing my participation potential is an action, just as not utilizing it is an action (omitted decision).

Exactly.

>This is truly difficult to investigate. The question is: where does the dependence lie and what kind of dependence do we talk about? Can you give an example?

Dependency reduces freedom, and I am speaking in the strictest sense of the word "dependence", since if you depend on something or someone to do this or that action, then you also depend on that something or someone allows you to do such a thing.

To depend is to need another, and if you need another to do something, you can not do that without the other, therefore, it does not depend solely on you, and therefore, again, you are not free to do that, since you need the approval of another.

When there is mutual dependence, both need mutual approval, therefore, both cooperate. When one party depends on the other, it needs to win the favor of the one on which it depends.

Although there is always a margin, even a very slight one, of freedom, in the same way that one cannot be totally free, freedom cannot either, it is impossible, be totally absent.

>Regarding "license": When I have the freedom to ignore a license because I just can afford not to use something which the license is about, I still have a certain amount of freedom, hence, can pick alternatives.

You're right, but that's an apparent freedom, it's an illusion of freedom, because if to do something I need someone's permission first (license), then I'm not free to do that, I have no free way to choose to do that when I want it, much less, but on the contrary, I can only do it when they (the authority) allow me, and after they let me, I'm free to do it or not, but only after they let me.

>One must develop some negotiation skills in order to stretch freedom to the most possible amount.

I would say that if you must negotiate with another to stretch the freedom, then it is not freedom, but it's license, because you need the permission of another, which you get through negotiation.

Both someone who has freedom and someone who has a license can do what they want to do, the difference is that the one who has freedom acts on the basis of his will, since he does not need anyone's permission, and the one who has a license acts on the basis of the will of another, since he needs precisely the permission of another to do what he wants.

The one who has a license is only "free" after they give him the license, but before, and if they don't give it, it's not free, therefore, the license is not true freedom.
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